The usual Open Thread rules apply. Be concise, be courteous and, above all, be amusing.
Open Thread
- Donald R. McClarey
Donald R. McClarey
Cradle Catholic. Active in the pro-life movement since 1973. Father of three, one in Heaven, and happily married for 43 years. Small town lawyer and amateur historian. Former president of the board of directors of the local crisis pregnancy center for a decade.
I don’t know if I would hold this against Bob Prevost when he was young and dumb and of small account in his order. This was when Reagan was getting nuclear missiles into NATO to counter a Soviet buildup. The European Left, led by Communist parties in Europe, went wild and massive protests were held. Reagan stood firm, as did NATO. One of several events that caused Gorbachev to conclude that the Soviet failing economy could not compete militarily with the US and to attempt to reform the Soviet Union, events which led to the downfall of Communism in Europe and the Soviet Union.
Prevost was far from making policy at that time and I am inclined to give him a pass. The problem is that the bad judgment he displayed then, he is continuing to show as Pope.
What concerns is that Leo was elected by (anti-Trump) cardinals not the Holy Spirit.
David, is there any way to interpret your statement as not schismatic?
I’ll hold it against someone. He was already ordained. He went from minor seminary to Villanova University to Augustinian formation programs and he lands at an obnoxious pro-Soviet political demonstration. How does his babble sound different from that of some teachers’ union denizen with a ‘Coexist’ sign on her lawn?
Does the Holy Spirit choose the Pope? Benedict XVI said no
I think the words like “schismatic” and “heretic” are tossed around too easily these days …
I’m familiar with that quote which is why I asked. I think the formulation “not the Holy Spirit” puts the comment into a different category.
You’re right that we throw around the word “heresy” too much, but I don’t think we use the term “schismatic” enough.
Well, B16 says he was elected by the college of Cardinals, not the Holy Spirit. I would be reluctant to call him a schismatic. 😀
As a man who once went to a “pro-choice” meeting cuz a cute college girl invited him, I’m willing to discount this a lot, perhaps entirely if Provost was to chalk it up to youth.
We will get no statement from the pope, is my prediction. I hope we do not get a doubling down…
There isn’t much indication of any discontinuity in his thinking between now and then.
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Please note that in 1983 the Baltic states were still subjugated and there were seven other captive nations in Eastern Europe (though it could be said that Hungary and Yugoslavia were no longer totalitarian at that point). There was a pipeline of arms and materiel which ran from Moscow to Central America via Cuba. The ghastly results of the fall of Indo-China were quite fresh. Yet, we have millions of numbnutzes in occidental countries telling us the threat was an increase in American military spending.
Pinky,
Yes, there is certainly a way to interpret my statement as not being schismatic
… to “think” the Holy Spirit always elects a pope “isn’t Catholic”.
David
“ “I would not say so, in the sense that the Holy Spirit picks out the Pope… I would say that the Spirit does not exactly take control of the affair, but rather, like a good educator, as it were, leaves us much space, much freedom, without entirely abandoning us. Thus the Spirit’s role should be understood in a much more elastic sense—not that he dictates the candidate for whom one must vote. Probably the only assurance he offers is that the thing cannot be totally ruined… There are too many contrary instances of popes the Holy Spirit obviously would not have picked!”
Cardinal Ratzinger
David, your explanation doesn’t seem sincere. If someone says “the traffic is heavy in Seattle” or “I’m late because the traffic is heavy in Seattle”, they’re expressing two different ideas. If you say that the pope isn’t picked by the Holy Spirit, that’s a slight misreading of Ratzinger, but if you say that you’re concerned because Leo wasn’t picked by the Holy Spirit, you’re referring to his election specifically. Would you be equally concerned thinking about the fact that the Holy Spirit didn’t “pick” Pius V? Have you told your wife that you’re concerned that the Holy Spirit didn’t “pick” her for you?
See: Mumia Abu Jamal. Jamal declared himself a sovereign nation of one person. Jamal executed two Philadelphia police officers. The two police officers were sovereign nations.
A sovereign king with no sovereign subjects is still a sovereign king with no sovereign subjects. Not having subjects makes no difference in his sovereignty over himself. His kingship having been instituted by sovereign persons and inherited.
A sovereign nation has sovereign persons who institute the sovereign nation. The sovereign nation has the same civil rights as the sovereign personhood of its sovereign citizens.
When two become one in fertilization, the single cell is infused with an immortal soul who designs the body and endows the human body with free will, intellect and sovereign personhood created by God.
God cannot contradict Himself, nor does God force any sovereign person into heaven.
All souls are created in original innocence and remain in original innocence until infused into the one celled human body where implicit Baptism, that is, the Baptism of Jesus Christ in the Jordan River, with all humanity in His Sacred Heart become implicitly Baptized until the Sacrament of Baptism is administered explicitly.
“I AM with you for all time.”
Concupiscence sticks like static cling around the newly begotten human being. According to Mary Immaculate’s Miraculous Medal the personal space surrounding her and the personal space surrounding each individual sovereign person is indefileable unless informed consent is made.