A good deal of this is on Father Pavone who over the years has had a very bad relationship with his Bishop and has been disobedient. However, Pavone’s being thrown out of the priesthood at a time when so many other priests actively promote heresy, is no doubt a convenient shot across the bow by the Vatican against all priests who take the teaching of the Church against abortion seriously.
Compare and Contrast:
Bishop Strickland doesn’t help the cause by casting Pavone as a holy priest. While he may be less deserving of what he got than others who are given a pass, but Pavone needed to be reigned in a long time ago.
” Pavone needed to be reigned in a long time ago.” Why?
Defending life of the unborn, our Constitutional Posterity, all future generations, the life of euthanasia victims, Terry Schiavo and all.
God creates the human soul in original innocence. The human being is procreated in original sin.
Mary, the Immaculate Conception came to announce that all human souls belong to “their Creator” (the Declaration of Independence)
Anyone who rejects our Founding Principles, rejects his citizenship, starting with President Biden and ought to be exiled as “persona non grata”.
Jesus Christ lived the spiritual and corporal works of mercy as well as the Beatitudes. Jesus Christ as did His mother Mary, did the will of God, the Father in heaven. God, the Father in heaven is the God of life.
Hell is the only place to exile these death peddlers
Yes, the flames of hell are reaching up…. climate change….
Pavone repeatedly ignored lawful directives from his bishop. He used to the pro-life cause to promote himself.
Good morning Greg.
He used to the pro-life cause to promote himself.
I am the first one to admit that I don’t follow the news as closely as I should..so please forgive me for my ignorance.
What was Fr. Pavone doing exactly that supports a statement of self promotion? Did he rake in donations from the faithful and renovate his residence? Was he flying around the country in a private jet eating caviar?
I’m sorry.
I haven’t looked closely into his private affairs. I suppose that he had an assigned parish and his focus for Life was causing problems taking care of his parish?
I’m just saddened by this news since his devotion to saving babies was paramount. In this current pontificate however, Barabbas would find himself elevated to Cardinal.
Too harsh ….too rigid is the move against him. I’m with Strickland.
I too am ignorant of what exactly prompted this. I know he was defiant with the Bishop of Amarillo but I thought his incarnation was changed to another diocese. Perhaps not or perhaps he had some egregious actions there. Perhaps they are being kind in not stating them but something this public and with the extreme of expelling Pavone from the priesthood justifies the listing of ills.
Should a priest always be obedient to a Bishop even when he’s clearly wrong? Very good discussion on obedience on the angry catholic in their last podcast with Janet Smith as guest. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-angry-catholic-show/id1457627215?i=1000589767823
Remember John Geoghan? There’s usually quite a bit of uncertainty about accused priests, but in his case, the archdiocesan chancery was by 1980 secure in its understanding that he was a paedophile and pederast who had actually molested youngsters. It took the archdiocese of Boston 12 years to put him on ice and an additional four years to laicize him.
I’m recalling Andrew Greeley insisted that he’d been refused a parish assignment in the Archdiocese of Chicago because he wouldn’t agree to a set of conditions. (The smart money says that was a pose and he did not, after 1964, actually want to do parish work; Cdl. Meyer’s last official act was a directive putting him on special detail). Greeley had a history of lobbing public insults at his bishop. He called Cdl. Cody a ‘madcap tyrant’ and called Cdl. Bernardin ‘Sammy Glick in Crimson’.
Does anyone have examples of the blasphemous statements he made?
With the disastrous, dysfunctional crowd ruining Holy Mother, likely he is being canonically cancelled.
As I recall, Fr. Pavone’s issues with the bishop of Amarillo, where he was for some reason incardinated though he never was assigned to a parish there, was related to how he reported the finances of Priests for Life. I do not know the full story because neither he nor Bishop Zurek disclosed much detail, in keeping with the apparent code of secrecy surrounding diocesan finances and management, at least in the US. I do know that at Bp. Zurek’s orders, Fr. Pavone stopped appearing on EWTN. The Vatican crowd now claims Fr. Pavone had multiple chances to defend himself, but Fr. Pavone told CNA he had no prior notice that this was in the works. Allegedly, Fr. Pavone also had problems with Cardinal Egan in New York. That was before my time as a Catholic and I have no knowledge of it one way or the other. It all seems rather contrived to me, but then I stopped trusting anything coming from Rome several years ago. I’m sure Fr. Pavone didn’t help himself by being an enthusiastic and vocal supporter of Orange Man Bad. And we all know that with leftists, which obviously includes the current Vatican regime, rules only apply to some people. I will pray that a more Catholic regime at the Holy See will find a way to reconcile with Fr. Pavone and reinstate his faculties, and that he will do his part to bring that about.
“…were related…”, not “was.” Sorry. 🤦🏻♂️
I will pray that a more Catholic regime at the Holy See will find a way to reconcile with Fr. Pavone and reinstate his faculties, and that he will do his part to bring that about.
Me too Frank…
Prayers for him today and tomorrow.
“Fr. Pavone didn’t help himself by being an enthusiastic and vocal supporter of Orange Man Bad.“
Roe was overturned.
I wonder IF Bishops have paid any thought to that at all.
Unless there is a very disturbing incident that requires such a dismissal than please forgive my upcoming rant.
If not I hope the Bishop listens to this.
The silence of Bishop’s have played a role in the greatest holocaust in modern history. Over 62 million dead in this country alone.
Silence. It’s sickening. I’m afraid of the eternal deaths that these mute shepherds will be experiencing. The silent ones who didn’t want to disturb the parishioners. Forgiveness is a Golden lifeline and a Bishop knows that. Speak forgiveness regarding abortion but by God speak up!
Lead. If you don’t lead, then priests without cowardice will lead and Fr. Pavone is one of them.
And now this?
It’s never comfortable to be the ramrod. To be in the front and stating a position that your superiors are too damn AFRAID to talk about.
Fr. Frank Pavone has done his due diligence and then some. He has carried the banner worthy to be called an ambassador of Jesus Christ the King. Not so of many a weak Bishop who have helped procure hundreds of thousands of deaths.
I’m ashamed of that poor group.
They should be too…if they vacated their responsibility as ambassadors for the most vulnerable. How dare this Bishop and the Vatican pull Fr. Provone…how embarrassing for them.
The ones behind the curtain. How telling of a broken pontificate and damaged Church. Self-mutilation within the Vatican.
Sad and shameful.
62 million deaths Bishops.
62 million souls that you didn’t help.
62 million because nobody would fight like heaven for these innocent individuals…but Fr. Pavone did.
where he was for some reason incardinated though he never was assigned to a parish there,
Seems to be a pattern with certain prominent priests. Fr. Gruner the Fatima promoter was incardinated in a diocese in India. Fr. Z was at one time incardinated in some diocese in Italy (while living i Wisconsin).
Phillip, how does Pavone promote himself? Well, when his bishop ordered him back to the diocese, Pavone started wailing about he heard the voices of unborn babies screaming for help and that. He was posturing as though he was so important to the cause, thus making it about him. Since Pavone has always been more of an activist than a priest, he can now focus solely on activism with the ecclesiastical constraints of the priesthood.
I meant to say “without the ecclesiastical constraints”.
I have never heard of Fr Pavone being disobedient to anyone in the manner suggested by this dismissal. I think there’s more behind the scenes. I do hope this isn’t merely a case of a few bishops being vindictive….
Thanks Greg Mockeridge.
Interesting take.
Full time activist without the collar.
Humm.
So Fr Pavone gets laicized while Fr Pfleger, Fr James Martin, et al are still in good standing? What the Sam Hill is going on here? Maybe his very public embrace of the MAGA movement and Trump candidacy was the last straw as far as the Vatican was concerned?
As for examples of the “blasphemous statements” he made, the only one I’ve seen so far is that he allegedly referred to Biden and/or his supporters as “GD losers” or words to that effect.
Here is Father Pavone’s articulation of the historical context https://www.frfrankpavone.com/pdf/ComboSummarypdf.pdf
I feel sure Father Pavone would readily admit he is not perfect and a sinner like the rest of us. So far, I see nothing that justifies his removal from the active priesthood. Pray that more Preist fail to blindly follow the orders of their Bishops. The majority of these Bishops are complicit in the greatest holocaust in world history, abortion. Is Bishop Strickland next? If you substituted “migration “ ( from which the Church takes in millions) instead of “abortion “ for his life’s work, he would be a valued Vatican adviser like the heretic James Martin, S.J.
“I am the God of Life” says God, the Father. Jesus and Mary,the Mother of God did the will of God, the Father in heaven perfectly. Father Pavone served the God of Life.
I have no respect for James Martin who insists that giving another man hemorrhoids in the anus is matrimony. The most shoplifted item in pharmacies is Preparation H.
Or that when two become one in fertilization, an immortal human soul is infused into the sovereign person newly begotten; 62 million have been murdered. Or that when a young adult without informed consent to give is sodomized, he is assaulted and battered, a crime.
Terry Schiavo was starved to death over eighteen days. Her parents asked for custody of her but no, the court insisted she be put to death for being the disabled wife of an adulterer. The court stationed a police officer to make sure no food or drink was given to Terry. Feed the hungry, a corporal work of mercy was dismissed because Terry was court ordered to die. Terry’s mother said that the flowers in her room got more water to drink than her daughter. Eighteen days to be starved to death and nobody complained except Father Frank Pavone. It is not human. This is not America.
Terry Schindler Shiavo please watch over Father Frank Pavone. And thanks.
Surely he must have been a known a paedophilia, homosexual, womaniser, thief or murderer to have been laicized. Surely. Oh that’s right, the Bishops turn a blind eye to those ones. Let’s kick the loud-mouth Fr Pavone out because he gives his superiors headaches and he can’t keep his mouth shut.
Ezabelle.
“I will tell you of William Wallace. Historians from Englad will say I am a liar, but history is written by those who have hanged heroes.”
I give thanks to God.
He sees all things and knows all hearts.
He is our judge and our brother.
Our redeemer.
Our Life.
His vantage point is greater and His vision clearer than any man alive.
Each man will have earned his reward.
Of that you can be certain.
Hell is real.
Many today are earning their rewards.
Comparisons to other priests more deserving of laicization is a non sequitur. Read what Pavone says in his own defense and you will see that he believes opposition to him is opposition to his cause. Such personification is rooted in pride. Many a Saint has been unjustly silenced by their superior, and in humility, they obeyed. He should have learned from them and instead of going the route of some other celebrity clerics.
If obedience was easy, we’d all be doing it.
“Many a Saint has been unjustly silenced by their superior, and in humility, they obeyed.”
Yes that’s all well and said, but it doesn’t answer the question of what did he do to deserve to be dismissed as a Priest. What are the blasphemous communications? What was the disobedience? Otherwise, the reason many people are understanding is that he was dismissed from priesthood for being a loud-mouth Trump supporter. That’s not grounds to dismiss a Priest from his vocation.
“Otherwise, the reason many people are understanding is that he was dismissed from priesthood for being a loud-mouth Trump supporter. ”
Father Pavone was /is a Trump supporter because Trump is/was pro-life. Trump supported Father Pavone’s work in the pro-life movement.
Pope Francis employs Paul Erlich with his POPULATION BOMB ethics. Ann Erlich has joined them
Not one of them uses the overpopulation ethic on themselves. They tyrannize the whole world with their POPULATION BOMB ethics. People as pollution. It is easier to murder your unborn neighbor, body and soul, than to fast and pray.
The mouth of the unborn soul is Father Pavone. Rome is trying to break Father Pavone. Rome did it to Padre Pio. The villagers came out to the monastry with pitchforks and rakes and demanded Padre Pio back and they got Padre Pio. Time to demand Father Pavone back at least before they, the powers that be, euthanize us all (with the corona virus) Hell is better than annihilation.
Phil Lawler shines light on the matter:
https://www.catholicculture.org/commentary/father-pavones-last-stand/
@CAG- thanks. Still no valid reason reasons in that article for grounds to dismiss him from his vocation. He was terrible with finances, he didn’t get along with his Bishop, he wanted to run PFL free from supervision. Blasphemy and disobedience were the reasons given. His conduct fell under neither.
Oh, he certainly is guilty of disobedience. Whether it rises to the level of laicization isn’t a call I’m qualified to make. I will say tossing a GD in a tweet is something you address with confession, not laicization. I’m wondering if there wasn’t something more.
Priests For Life is over $1 million in debt. It would be irresponsible for the bishop to ignore that, but Fr. Pavone isn’t offering any explanation as to where the money went. I’m remembering Fr. Corapi … Celebrity priests need oversight. For their own good, and the good of the faithful.
Former Priests for Life colleague gives his take on the situation here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZvPRp70RfE
Unless the reasons come from the people who dismissed him, it’s all speculation and guessing.
Ezabelle, you cannot say that his conduct didn’t include disobedience when it is clear that his bishop attempted to restrict his activities and he resisted. That is disobedience. Debatable as to whether it merited laicization, but his bishop sure thought so. That he’s seeking to be incarded elsewhere is further indication that he disagrees with the authority above him. He is going down the path of other celebrity priests, allowing their cult of personality to interfere with a very necessary and important mission; in this case, saving the unborn.
Given the quality of American bishops, most of whom the faithful never sees or hears from unless said bishop wants money, I stand with Fr. Pavone.
St. John Chrysostom, Bishop Zurek. Learn his words.
I can see him being put under an interdict, but laicizing him seems another exercise in abuse of power by whatshisname.
I agree with Art, and “whatshisname” isn’t about to explain himself here either because supreme pontiff and all that.
Phil Lawler today: (the previous link was the 2011 article mentioned in Greg’s video post)
https://www.catholicculture.org/commentary/vaticans-action-against-frank-pavone-overdue-yet-unexplained/
Sorry, not buying Lawler’s argument.
@Greg and Bill- again…,the Vatican has yet to give official examples of any of your claims. To think they don’t owe the Faithful an official explanation for defrocking a Catholic priest is arrogant and unacceptable. The lack of transparency from the Vatican is the reason why we are all arguing in the Catholic blogosphere about the matter.
To think they don’t owe the Faithful an official explanation for defrocking a Catholic priest is arrogant and unacceptable.
Just to clear Im calling the Vatican out for arrogance (not Greg and Bill). I should have worded my comment better.
If Father Frank Pavone deserse laicization for protecting the unborn sovereign souls, then what does “what’shisname” Pope Francis deserve for calling parents “rabbity” and promoting abortion via Paul Erlich?
Thanks CAG. Good article.
So often I’m reminded of this maxim that is imbedded in my engineering mind and so absent in the narratives within social media: “more than one thing can be true at the same time.”
If Father Pavone deserves laicization for protecting Life, then what does Father Pacamama deserve? sodomite blesser? Women priest blesser? Naked man on the Nativity scene? What then? The laity want to know.
The Bishops owe the faithful a full explanation. It’s the height of clericalism to presume they don’t.
“Given the quality of American bishops, most of whom the faithful never sees or hears from unless said bishop wants money, I stand with Fr. Pavone.“
To use the failings of U.S. Bishops to justify what Pavone has done and still doing (he is still wearing clerical garb in public) is pretty childish moral reasoning.