Timothy Cardinal Dolan: Company Man

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Timothy Cardinal Dolan, of the Archdiocese of New York, is the epitome of the company man.  When the powers that be in his company, the Church, were orthodox and perceived to be conservative, that is what he was.  Now, well Rorate Caeli gives us a sample of what he is now:

 

“Who am I to judge?” makes a triumphant entry in the American subset of the College of Cardinals, in an interview granted to the highest-rated political debate program on US television, to be broadcast tomorrow:

 
Cardinal Timothy Dolan of New York praised University of Missouri football star Michael Sam for coming out as gay, saying he would not judge the athlete for his sexual orientation. “Good for him,” Dolan said in an interview with NBC’s “Meet the Press” airing Sunday.
 
“I would have no sense of judgment on him,” Dolan continued. “God bless ya. I don’t think, look, the same Bible that tells us, that teaches us well about the virtues of chastity and the virtue of fidelity and marriage also tells us not to judge people. So I would say, ‘Bravo.’” [Source]
 
OK, then. Naturally, the Cardinal did not have to say anything at all regarding a specific individual, even if asked. But silence and discretion are one thing, explicitly refusing moral discernment is another, and raising such refusal to the status of “good” and “bravo” is quite noteworthy for a Prince of the Church, because it is in itself a moral judgment, a positive moral judgment.
 
It is quite easy to see that no moral debate in which the Catholic Church takes part, of any kind and on any level, can ever anymore advance even one inch if the parameters become simply an isolated reading of “not judging” – and much less if “not judging” is elevated to the positive judgment of “good” and “bravo.” Politicians quote a pontiff when casting immoral votes, and what can the Church say, from now on, on any legal matter (that presupposes a moral order)? It can always be used to stop any social debate.
Go here to read the rest.  A throw away line of Pope Francis in an interview is thus made an eleventh commandment for the Church.  Who are you to judge, Dolan?  You are a prince of the Church, and if you do not think that requires judging, and standing up fearlessly for the Truth, no matter what you perceive the attitude to be in the Vatican, it is past time for you to resign.  Careerism and cowardice have ever been mortal enemies of the Faith, and both appear to be flourishing under the current pontificate.
Who and Am I To Judge
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43 Responses to Timothy Cardinal Dolan: Company Man

  • Coming out as a gay sportsperson is good PR for the person and for the team. It puts more bums on seats, and consequently more dollars in pockets.
    They (the gay community) shouldn’t kid themselves as its not a genuine stand for “equality” and breaking down prejudices blah blah blah. When you’re kicking, bouncing or throwing a ball, what does it matter who you cuddle up to at night (sorry to be graphic)? Why “come-out”? Does it suddenly change the persons skill-set?

    “Coming out” in sport is a current hype that will soon grow tired and old.

    I don’t know why the Cardinal even bothered to comment.

  • Donald McClarey- if you posted a series called “Dolan Watch” !
    There would be lots of grist for the mill.

  • “Careerism and cowardice have ever been mortal enemies of the Faith, and both appear to be flourishing under the current pontificate. ”
    A person’s true colors show in the heat and light of battle. That helps us. When satan exposes himself we can better protect ourselves and loved ones.

  • Just imagine the millions of teens who hear this “Bravo” “Good for him” on coming out per se ( not coming out plus chastity pledge) from Dolan; they will hear it just as a blurb on the news or on the commercial for “Meet the Press”….just in the northeast in general…millions. Dolan just raised the misguided empathy percent for decades to come and lowered the chastity bar for unmarried youth in general. Bill Donohue will want to defend him but will stay way out of this one…you’d need to be a whirling dervish to spin this one. Pray that Dolan sees through himself and pulls far back from whatever his weird motives are because Christ said of every idle word will we give an account but Wisdom raises those stakes for the prominent…

    Wisdom 6:6 “For the lowly may be pardoned out of mercy
    but the mighty shall be mightily put to the test….
    8 “but for those in power a rigorous scrutiny impends.”

  • Dolan, like Pope Bergoglio, talks too much.

  • I would not put it past the press agents at NBC to slice, dice, and fabricate the Cardinal’s remarks. It is flabbergasting to think that a prince of the Church would say something so inane.

  • Here is a link to the video clip of the Cardinal and his “bravo moment”:

    http://www.towleroad.com/2014/03/dolansam.html

  • Just saw the entire interview. Dolan was mainly serious and did say those things even after saying that a good teacher knows the power of the audio visual and implying that the Pope says controversial sound bites to get people discussing etc. In context, I think Dolan may have been surprised by the question about the athelete but he said those reported things ( good for him…bravo) without being in a laugh a second modality at all. I think a spin is possible within the surprise context if the question was a surprise which I don’t know…the best spin is this: Dolan may have meant that hiding your orientation from society as a public figure is unhealthy and sad and coming out is thus good. But teens didn’t watch him get surprised in context. They don’t watch Meet the Press. They see the commercial featuring him while watching something else or they see an internet or newspaper blurb which then comes across as a teaching moment by Dolan rather than an in context surprised and partial truth reaction to perhaps the sadness of being covert about your orientation.
    Oddly the Church has really distanced itself from Romans chapter one which sees gay actions as the result of previous non sexual sin…the depart from God into idolatry…which leads circuitously to gay active life. It may well be the pattern that happens within modern pre teens who neglect God and idolize gadgets, popular cliques at school, certain singers. Imagine if Romans one was relevant all along but in a modern way. Wouldn’t that be surprising?

  • I’m really surprised the bishops don’t have pat answers for these types of questions already. Here are some easy bullet points for the future:

    According to the catechism, homosexuals are not to be subjected to unjust discrimination so good for Michael Sam. Nevertheless, Michael Sam is required to be chaste. Why are you asking me about 1 homosexual in the NFL when we all know that locker rooms in general and the NFL in particular are places where men talk about the various acts of depravity they engaged in with their latest “groupie” conquest? As a bishop, shouldn’t I be more concerned that the vast majority of NFL athletes brag about their mortal sin?

  • The tone deafness of the hierarchy is something to behold. Simply tell the interviewer that you won’t discuss homosexual “marriage” unless it is in the context of the complete Catholic teaching on sexual morality. You mainstream media types want to ask me about Michael Sam? Really? So you want me to comment on a mortal sin that affects a small percentage of the population? Good, I’ll take the opportunity to tell you that millions more are more affected by the ubiquity of heterosexual sodomy that is literally a click away for almost all of the population with internet access. Sexual immorality leads to std’s as sure as gluttony leads to Type II diabetes. The Catholic Church is opposed to them ALL because they violate the natural law and are opposed to the plan God has for human beings made in His image and likeness.

  • Really though – who am I to judge the cardinal. He really is in a tough spot. The whole Church is. You ca’t boil the Church down to sound bites. I am glad I am not in his position.

  • “I am glad I am not in his position.”

    I would be glad if he were not in his position.

  • According to the catechism, homosexuals are not to be subjected to unjust discrimination so good for Michael Sam.

    Good for him for what? For being an exhibitionist?

  • What would St. Paul do were he in Cardinal Dolan’s place? Well he was, and this is what he said:

    “For though absent in body I am present in spirit, and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment in the name of the Lord Jesus on the man who has done such a thing. When you are assembled, and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.” 1st Corinthians 5:3-5

    “Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor penetrators of mankind nor receivers of penetration, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God.” 1st Corinthians 6:9-10

    The floor of hell is paved with the skulls of bishops – and not a few cardinals either.

    http://www.stpeterslist.com/7334/the-path-to-hell-is-paved-with-the-skulls-of-bishops-8-quotes-and-sources/

  • Tom M. hits it on the head. Frankly, Tom M.’s “soundbite” sounds pretty much like St. Paul’s rant on the topic.
    The Pope opened the door for this opportunity to take the high ground back from the homos. Go Pope!

  • “Good for him for what?”

    Not for being an exhibitionist per se, but for being a good football player who, by all appearances, is as qualified to play in the NFL as anyone else (including those who engage in other seriously sinful activities and lifestyles). As far as Cardinal Dolan being asked about him, my suggested answer would be: “Michael Sam is not, to my knowledge, Catholic and has not requested my advice or pastoral counsel regarding his personal situation so I am not going to give it here. That said…. here is what the Church teaches in general regarding homosexuality.”

    In an ideal world, Sam’s announcement would NOT be news for either or both of two reasons: 1. The reaction of the sports world would be “Yeah, so what? All we care about is how well you can play football.” 2. Athletes would not be regarded as role models or idols but as ordinary human beings doing a job, whose opinions regarding homosexuality or any other issue carried no more or less weight than anyone else’s.

  • Anzlyne: “Really though – who am I to judge the cardinal. He really is in a tough spot. The whole Church is. You ca’t boil the Church down to sound bites. I am glad I am not in his position.”
    .
    The whole Church are the Saints in heaven, the militant church on earth and the suffering souls in purgatory. Heaven is full of souls who kept to the law.

  • The Pope and the Cardinal seemed to have learned nothing
    from the recent scandal involving the downtrodden homosexual.

  • “Michael Sam is not, to my knowledge, Catholic and has not requested my advice or pastoral counsel regarding his personal situation so I am not going to give it here. That said…. here is what the Church teaches in general regarding homosexuality.” Yes. Well stated. That would have been a more prudent answer.

    The Interviewer set the bait, and the Cardinal bit. Hopefully, he will know for next time.

  • Whether caught by surprise or not, one would think a ‘prince of the Church’ would have solid stances on the things the Church teaches and not be like a politician. C. Dolan is an embarrassment. The hedging on moral issues by far too many in the Church hierarchy sets a dangerous precedence: it leaves many comfortable in sin, if confuses many, and leaves those who know their faith and have the courage and strength to stand up for it in a place where no one has their back. None of this is new. I think of Arianism and almost all bishops caved. I think of Lutheranism and protestanism and in some countries almost all the bishops caved. I think of Nazi Germany and many bishops caved. I think of a Bl. like Franz Jaggerstatter whose bishop and priest said he could join the Nazi army because he had a family to think of. He held fast despite bad advice and was killed and now is beatified.

    We may be coming to a time when we individual Catholics will have to take the punishment ourselves for standing for the truth as our cowardly prelates go with the worldly flow. That makes for the time of saints. C. Dolan has said he wants to be a saint but it will not happen at this pace; he needs to repent and find a spine.

  • Unfortunately, Cardinal Dolan has been the company man for a long time. He was happy that “universal health insurance” became law of the land before the HHS mandate “surprised” him. And he did (is doing) nothing except spin, spin, spin when it “came out” that the NY archdiocesan health insurance covers abortions & contraceptives. He loves Obama, didn’t he go to that swanky black tie presidential dinner to rub elbows with him? I listen to the Catholic Channel, but cannot listen to Cardinal Dolan’s voice. I pray for him to repent & convert, but I’m afraid he’s one of those whom Pope Francis was talking about when he said he doesn’t want any careerist priests. Interestingly, when you’re a careerist, the pride blinds you & you don’t even know that you are one.

  • Was the guy any good? I don’t follow professional, large-dude B-ball.

    Dipsarate impact!

    Young Tim isn’t up on 21st century civil rights crises, either.

    The NBA discrimates (effects test) against normal-sized whites. Tall blacks comprise 70%+ of the players, but way less than 16% of the US population. If we applied the official, Obama regime civil rights tactics, there would be sanctions on the NBA until 66% of the players were not-huge, white heterosexuals.

  • I am SO disappointed about this. God gave my wife and I children. We, as their parents, had the responsibility to teach them right & wrong, guide them in their relationship skills with others and set example. This also included saying NO! “That is not allowed.”
    The kids did NOT LIKE it when we had to do that. Too bad—It was the right thing for us to do. Cardinal Dolan has been placed by God (right?) in a lofty parental position albeit spiritual. Along with that comes the duty to say NO! Like it or not—End of story

  • Not surprising, when you think about it.

    This is the same Cardinal who said of contraception “Whoa, let’s stay away from talking abut that Teaching…” 40 years of abortion, and he can’t speak about contraception as an anti-life act and mutual masturbation. NFP as good, pure and natural. Abortion as backup birth control to contraceptive failure. Where “birth control” is really the demand to have sex and no babies, the lead to acceptance of homosexual behavior.

    Can we really expect him to speak in clear terms about what the Church Teaches on Homosexual behavior with the cameras rolling?

  • In an ideal world, Sam’s announcement would NOT be news for either or both of two reasons: 1. The reaction of the sports world would be “Yeah, so what? All we care about is how well you can play football.” 2. Athletes would not be regarded as role models or idols but as ordinary human beings doing a job, whose opinions regarding homosexuality or any other issue carried no more or less weight than anyone else’s.

    No, Elaine. In a better world, Sam’s announcement would not be news because the people who heard it would be too embarrassed to report it.

  • I have long cherished a couplet of Mgr Ronald Knox’s in a satiric poem, written in 1913, on his brother clergymen at Oxford, written in the manner of Dryden

    “When suave Politeness, temp’ring bigot Zeal,
    Corrected, “I believe,” to” One does feel.”

  • This example is precisely the argument all of my teenage and college age grandchildren and yes some of my adult children, who are extremely active in the Catholic church use to “put me” in my “old fashioned” world view of the “teachings of the church” places. Who am I to compete with the likes of Timothy Cardinal Dolan. Rationalization comes very easy when you have quotes in print. “I know a lot of gay people grandma and they are better than a lot of Catholic’s I know.” Unless I want to completely destroy every gathering we have until I die, I must hold my tongue. After all I am not very educated. :(

  • Just like the guy in the Whitehouse, I will not listen any longer.

  • Advice from 630+ years ago: Excerpt, Letter to Gregory XI by St Catherine of Siena, ca. 1375, bemoaning the Pope’s selections of certain cardinals: “…I have heard that you created the Cardinals. Believe me, it would have been more to God’s honor and in your better interests to always choose men of virtue. Not to do this is to insult God and to ruin the Church; And we cant be surprised if God sends us punishments and scourges, for it is only just.”

  • Steve Phoenix

    One does not have to go back that far. At the time of the Revolution in 1789, the five French Cardinals, Rohan, Loménie de Brienne, Bernis, Montmorency and Talleyrand (the uncle of the statesman) were all, as the Catholic historian, Lord Acton, puts it, “men notoriously of evil repute.”

    Why that should be so is explained by Hilaire Belloc: “he very fact that the Church had thus become in France an unshakable national institution, chilled the vital source of Catholicism. Not only did the hierarchy stand in a perpetual suspicion of the Roman See, and toy with the conception of national independence, but they, and all the official organisation of French Catholicism, put the security of the national establishment and its intimate attachment to the general political structure of the State, far beyond the sanctity of Catholic dogma or the practice of Catholic morals.”

    Sound familiar?

  • “”I know a lot of gay people grandma and they are better than a lot of Catholic’s I know.””
    .
    Then you ought to help them get to heaven by reminding them of their immortal souls. Explain that being “homosexually oriented” is not a sin but an act of God. Only sodomy is a sin

  • I think these two quotes from St. Augustine seem appropos for Cdl. Dolan and millions of poorly catechized, catholics.

    “What is reprehensible is that, while leading good lives themselves and abhorring those of wicked men, some fearing to offend shut their eyes to evil deeds instead of condemning them and pointing out their malice. To be sure, the motive behind their tolerance is that they may suffer no hurt in the possession of those temporal goods which virtuous and blameless men may lawfully enjoy; still, there is more self-seeking here than becomes men who are mere sojourners in this world and who profess hope of a home in heaven.”

    “The only evils these people recognize are having to endure hunger, disease, and murder. It is as though man’s greatest good were to have everything good, except himself.”

  • And when a guy comes out and says he likes to be with animals, BRAVO!

  • “And not only do they do these things, but applaud others doing them”. I don’t think the last words of Romans One apply to the Cardinal but they do to certain others. Perhaps the Cardinal did not think quickly enough on his feet to consider how Sam’s announcement of how comfortable he is with being proudly gay makes most of us uncomfortable. Why can’t Sam just play ball and shut up? Why does not the love that dared not speak its name in better times just shut up? Is it a battle cry in the Culture War?

  • I always rather liked the remark of the Anglican Benedictine and liturgical scholar, Dom Gregory Dix: “I really don’t see why you should be surprised at the conduct of your Fathers in God. After all the insignia of a Bishop is a crook and of an Archbishop a double-cross.”

  • Back in January I was stunned when the Church of England made it “optional” for the parents and Godparents to use the words “Reject Satan” in Baptismal ceremonies. Their reason–”so as not to offend anyone”. Dear Cardinal Dolan, who I truly respect and admire, has gone down that “slippery slope” in being PC. Avoiding perceived Intolerance at all costs to feign tolerance is a no win method of defending the faith. I’m hoping he does clarify what he meant.

  • “And when a guy comes out and says he likes to be with animals, BRAVO!”

    Well, so far the only guy in the NFL who has ever admitted that he “likes to be with animals” (in a completely different sense, of course) has gotten nothing but grief for it:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Vick

  • Three warnings have already been prophesied for the City of the Seven Hills
    http://www.prophetamos3m.com/6.html

  • Hasn’t anyone here ever said the wrong thing, or “put their foot in it”, or been caught by surprise, or regretted a particular conversation or even maybe thought they should have said things better? Ever?

    I have.

    It’s Lent. Give him the benefit of the doubt, as I suspect he is cringing at the thought of the interview. Don’t attack him. “Princes of the Church” are not perfect, because they are not God. As you would know, even St Peter said some doozies a number of times.

  • Did Card. Dolan suddenly “come out” in favor of homosexual “marriage”? Did he challenge the Church’s position that homosexual acts or intrinsically disordered? No, he was just making a statement about one person realizing who they truly are.

    Come on folks.

  • i suggest that in the future catholic leaders put on the spot like this simply explain two things, first, the sexual orientation of a specific person seeking to be chaste is not a subject i feel free to discuss.

    and second , the key point in discussing human sexuality is what the Church teaches, that unless sexual acts occur within a permanent and exclusive relationship between one man and one woman, they are sinful and disordered.

  • No, he was just making a statement about one person realizing who they truly are.

    One person making a public point of his sexual perversions.

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