Thursday, March 28, AD 2024 5:56pm

Pope Ends Synod With Classless Address

Pope of Mercy

 

It has been quite some time since the Church has had a pope as small-minded, vindictive and vengeful as the “Pope of mercy”, Pope Francis.  In his closing address to the Synod he took several swipes at those who fought his rigging of the process:

It was also about laying closed hearts, which bare the closed hearts which frequently hide even behind the Church’s teachings or good intentions, in order to sit in the chair of Moses and judge, sometimes with superiority and superficiality, difficult cases and wounded families.

It was about making clear that the Church is a Church of the poor in spirit and of sinners seeking forgiveness, not simply of the righteous and the holy, but rather of those who are righteous and holy precisely when they feel themselves poor sinners.

It was about trying to open up broader horizons, rising above conspiracy theories and blinkered viewpoints, so as to defend and spread the freedom of the children of God, and to transmit the beauty of Christian Newness, at times encrusted in a language which is archaic or simply incomprehensible.

In the course of this Synod, the different opinions which were freely expressed – and at times, unfortunately, not in entirely well-meaning ways – certainly led to a rich and lively dialogue; they offered a vivid image of a Church which does not simply “rubberstamp”, but draws from the sources of her faith living waters to refresh parched hearts.

Go here to read the rest.  The rest of this barely concealed diatribe indicates clearly that he will allow, in his new Synodal Catholic Church, portions that wish to do so, to in effect jettison the moral teachings of the Catholic Church that do not find favor with the chattering classes of the West.  Schism looms, God help us all.

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Paul W Primavera
Paul W Primavera
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 3:03pm

Pope Francis deserved to receive that Communist Crucifix. That is who and what he is. But the Church will outlast him as she did Pope Alexander VI. He may yet be the subject of a future Dante’s writing on hell.

Cthemfly25
Cthemfly25
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 3:18pm

Unfortunately, the pope has advanced his cause, the cause of the Kasperites, simply the way in which he conducted the synod. Let’s be blunt: he and his henchman attempted to cheat, deceive, and coerce a preordained outcome. He is now telling us through his petulant remarks that he will stop at nothing to win including slander those with whom he disagrees.

Phillip
Phillip
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 3:30pm
Art Deco
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 3:57pm

It takes fewer man-hours to demolish a building than to construct one. Not sure how long it will take the effective teaching authority of the papacy to recover after just 30 months in the hands of a fountainhead of humbug.

Karl
Karl
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 4:06pm

At our son’s marriage my wife was given permission to receive communion. An unrepentant adulterer was allowed to receive in front of her children and her real husband.

I walked out.

It has long been this way, Don. Now it will just be “out of the closet”! Nothing has changed save formality. Marriages died, at least in America, in 1977 when excommunication was ceased for civil remarriage when the bond remained.

Karl

Bleuteaux
Bleuteaux
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 4:45pm

I’m just going to throw this out there. Feel free to call me crazy.

I went to a Jesuit university, graduating within the last ten years. Francis reminds me of our very recently retired president (himself a Jesuit). The guy was for sure a liberal, but not an activist, and not very bright. He had a good heart, but let every university bureaucrat and activist run roughshod over the entire university. He was a pawn of the campus leftists.

Francis reminds me of this. I don’t think he’s very bright. It’s not his fault, we can’t all have the intelligence of Benedict. He’s also a liberal, obviously. But he doesn’t strike me as particularly activist leftist. Sure, he’d be happy with more liberal accommodations, but he hasn’t spent his life dreaming up destruction akin to the average college professor.

Where the real destruction happens — at my Jesuit university, as with Francis — is that he does seem willing to give as much reign as possible to the real activists. He’s sympathetic with their cause, if not as openly blood thirsty.

I’ve never seen anyone state this elsewhere, so just wanted to throw this out there. I think people are giving Francis too much “credit” for wanting to change the Church. The issue is that he’s dull enough to agree with most of liberalism, and dull enough to give liberalism a chance at reigning, as if we haven’t been down this road a million times before.

Franco
Franco
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 5:38pm

There are reports at the today’s media conference of the synod
that progressive members have stated a new Church has emerged
from the Synod on the Family.

Ronald Sevenster
Ronald Sevenster
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 5:53pm

This Pope has the same mentality as President Obama. The world wouldn’t be much different if Francis were President of the US and Obama Pope, except that in such a case the Pope wouldn’t be a Catholic and the President not an American. But it wouldn’t mattter much either, since Bergoglio is about as much American as Obama and Obama almost as Catholic as this Pope. Both are the type of leftist revolutionary community organizers. Obama wants to fundamentally transform the US, the same thing as the Pope is attempting to do with the Church. Both are deeply at odds with the institutions they represent.

Elizabeth Fitzmaurice
Elizabeth Fitzmaurice
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 5:55pm

@Franco: I heard much about this “New Church” from some of the Synod Fathers during the Press Conference, talked about here by Michael Matt who was at this Press Conference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yHXKqKo-GM

Dale Price
Dale Price
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 7:21pm

Well, at least he’s not trying to hide his progressive favoritism anymore. He wasn’t good at it before, but now the mask is off completely.

Patricia
Patricia
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 7:27pm

‘ …It was about bearing witness to everyone that, for the Church, the Gospel continues to be a vital source of eternal newness, against all those who would “indoctrinate” it in dead stones to be hurled at others. …’

Who is throwing stones at whom? and would this mean that the Gospel as written with our Lord’s teaching is ‘dead’ now for some who may not agree with Ash Wednesday’s message to repent and believe in the Gospel?

T. Shaw
T. Shaw
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 7:35pm

Liberals aren’t smart and, worse, can’t handle the Truth. It gets in the way of the agenda.
.
Among my former (I recently retired) co-workers a common insult was to say, “You have a firm grasp of the obvious.” Liberals refuse can’t grasp the Truth.
.
We’ve been force-fed this gay nonsense for decades. It has nothing to do with love. It has to do with sodomy. Apparently, this pope and certain bishops/cardinals covertly concur with the gay gestapo’s propaganda.
.
When five robed morons’ legalized pretend (You can call a dog’s tail a leg, but it still has four legs.) gay marriage, the gassy gays slogan was, “Love Wins.” The truth is “Sin Wins.” The true scandal is that so few Catholics, lay or clergy, stated such.
.

.

Ken
Ken
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 7:48pm

My initial take is that this is a victory for orthodoxy and tradition. At the same time it is a grievous wound for the Church. The council of Nicaea did not end arianism, but it dealt a substantial blow; a blow which ultimately was fatal.

Jesus came to divide not unite. The wheat versus the chaff, all that good stuff. It is my opinion that the journey will only become tougher, but we must persevere.

PS. because he is my ordinary, I still hope Cupich proclaims the Gospel to a bunch of penguins (not Philadelphians) or experiences a conversion.

Rosey
Rosey
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 8:30pm

Sad, petulant, dull, angry–I see all
these in the comments, and all I
Have to say is, gee, those are all attributes of a humble person, right guys?

I’m still floored every time I recall him stepping onto that balcony, and the horrific feeling of dread (for no known reason, I was watching with others in excited anticipation) I had, which was then deepened, and an added sense of being set up set in when the MSM almost immediately dubbed him “humble.” It was weird.
May God forgive me, but that is genuinely what I felt.

Edward Lewis
Edward Lewis
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 8:54pm

Pope Francis is to the Medici Popes what Obama is to Jimmy Carter. Toothy Jimmy can go to his grave knowing he will not be remembered as the worst president the country ever had.

Penguin Fan
Penguin Fan
Saturday, October 24, AD 2015 9:19pm

Hi, Ken,
The Penguins are from Pittsburgh, not Philadelphia……….,
Anyway, I remember the meltdown at Rotate after Pope Francis was elected.
He has struck me as a Caudillo, a Latin American brand of dictator, who obtains and retains power by pointing out and bad mouthing enemies.
He has bad mouthed Tradition, the Curia, free market economics, the President of Paraguay and now the opponents of Cardinal Kasper and Kasper’s pathetic scheme. He trashed the FFI and demoted Cardinal Burke. He has berated abusive clergy but put the despicable Cardinal Daneels in the Synod and appointed the bishop in Chile against the wishes of those who knew of his past. He writes about the enviornment..not an area of his expertise, and is extremely timid in defense of the ISIS victims and silent about Asia Bibi.
In short, he is an intellectual lightweight, one who knows less about the world than any Catholic in the Holy See should know, and refuses to identify the real enemies of the Church – secularism, homosexualism and Islam.
As he is Pope, we need to pray for him, but we don’t have to like him, and I do not.

Mara319
Mara319
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 1:42am

Well, there seems to be two different speeches the Pope delivered at the closing of the Synod. Which one was it? Is it this:
http://www.catholicworldreport.com/Blog/4313/pope_francis_address_at_conclusion_of_synod_of_bishops_full_text.aspx

or this?:
http://en.radiovaticana.va/news/2014/10/18/pope_francis_speech_at_the_conclusion_of_the_synod/1108944

From the first link:

“It was also about laying closed hearts, which bare the closed hearts which frequently hide even behind the Church’s teachings or good intentions, in order to sit in the chair of Moses and judge, sometimes with superiority and superficiality, difficult cases and wounded families.”

[Funny how the Pope made reference to the “chair of Moses” when it was Moses who allowed divorce due to the “hardness of man’s heat.”]

From the second link: [The Pope, obviously not an equal opportunity scolder, nevertheless has a couple of tiny snippets hurled at the liberals:]

” – The temptation to a destructive tendency to goodness [it. buonismo], that in the name of a deceptive mercy binds the wounds without first curing them and treating them; that treats the symptoms and not the causes and the roots. It is the temptation of the “do-gooders,” of the fearful, and also of the so-called “progressives and liberals.”

“- The temptation to come down off the Cross, to please the people, and not stay there, in order to fulfil the will of the Father; to bow down to a worldly spirit instead of purifying it and bending it to the Spirit of God.”

Murray
Murray
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 2:04am

Mara, your second set of quotes is from the pope’s closing address to last year’s synod. At the time, I thought that speech was a bit of a tantrum, but this year’s version? Boy, we’re in for it now.

Mara319
Mara319
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 2:22am

Thank you, Murray, for the clarification. I followed the link given by Pewsitter three taglines below the “classless.” And you’re right, it was last year’s closing speech. Thanks again. God bless.

Michael Dowd
Michael Dowd
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 3:07am

We all know that God permits the devil to do evil things that, we believe, have positive consequences now or in the future. In the case of Pope Francis we have someone who is most divisive. He is dividing those who accept and proclaim the historical doctrine of the Catholic Church from those who don’t. He is separating the sheep from the wolves, the wheat from the chaff, those on Christ’s right side from those on the left. So, we can conclude, that despite himself and his intentions, Pope Francis is fulfilling the will of God even though he himself appears to reject it. Indeed, mysterious are the ways of the Lord.

bigfred
bigfred
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 8:04am

Hello, everybody. So now… how will the petty and spiteful Francis get revenge on Cdl Pell?

Guy McClung
Admin
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 8:43am

Big Fred, A whole lot of folks better watch out . . . remember the end of the quote “Revenge is mine sayeth the Lord” ? It is “and I will repay.” I wouldn’t be standing near Bergoglio or his cadre anytime soon. Guy McClung, San Antonio TX

bigfred
bigfred
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 8:47am

@Bleuteaux, who says, “[Francis would] be happy with more liberal accommodations, but he hasn’t spent his life dreaming up destruction akin to the average college professor.”

Hi, Bleuteaux. Don’t forget that soon after being elected, he predicted “you’ll be sorrrrry”.

In his America interview Sep 2013, I take his use of the word “discernment” to mean strategically plotting over long periods.

http://americamagazine.org/pope-interview

“This discernment takes time. For example, many think that changes and reforms can take place in a short time. I believe that we always need time to lay the foundations for real, effective change… Discernment in the Lord guides me in my way of governing.”

“But I am always wary of decisions made hastily… I have to wait and assess, looking deep into myself, taking the necessary time. The wisdom of discernment redeems the necessary ambiguity of life and helps us find the most appropriate means…”

Francis was early on openly telling everybody what he is all about, even throwing in his favorite deceptive tactic of ambiguity.

bigfred
bigfred
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 8:56am

I hope so, it’s been a long time coming. Too long.

Btw, I’ve just read that Pell had some seemingly complimentary things to say about Obama years ago. Weird world, just like “country” Tim McGraw and Toby Keith admiring Cinton and Obama.

And lib Wuerl revived the Latin Mass when he was in Pittsburgh? Curiouser an curiouser.

Franco
Franco
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 10:48am

84. “The baptized who are divorced and civilly remarried
are to be more integrated in the Christian communities
in the various possible ways, avoiding every occasion of scandal.
The logic of integration is the key to their pastoral accompaniment,
so that they be aware not only that they belong to the Body of
Christ, that is the Church, but that they may have a joyful and
fruitful experience. They are baptized, they are brothers and
sisters, the Holy Spirit pours gifts and charisms in them
for the good of all. Their participation can be expressed in
various ecclesial services: it is therefore necessary to discern
which of the different forms of exclusion currently
practiced in a liturgical, educational, pastoral, and
institutional role that can be overcome. They should not only
not feel excommunicated, but they should live and mature as
living members of the Church, feeling her as a mother that
welcomes them always, takes care of them affectionately,
and encourages them on the path of life and Gospel. This
integration is necessary for the Christian care and education
of their children, who must be considered what is most
important. For the Christian community, taking care of these
persons is not a weakening of their own faith and testimony
regarding matrimonial indissolubility: rather, the Church
expresses precisely in this care her charity.” Final Relatio

People who are determined in mortal sin must be allowed to overcome
any exclusions that would deny them full membership in the
Sacramental Church. Bringing repented souls to God’s mercy
is no longer a worthy goal for the Church. Welcoming
determined adulterers and sodomites into the Church to affirm
their self-esteem in the Church and in the Christian community
is the new purpose of the new Catholic Church, which
has abandoned Christ and His moral teachings for a new
theology, similar to the Unitarian Church, of a feel-good modern
pop psychology for lunatics.

Pedro Erik
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 11:53am

And what about thsi passagem of his speech that is pure protestatism, exalting mercy, excluding works, sins and sanctity.

And by the way, none passages used support his arguments. Nor Romans, Nor Psalm, nor Saint Lukes, of course.

See what he said:

The Synod experience also made us better realize that the true defenders of doctrine are not those who uphold its letter, but its spirit; not ideas but people; not formulae but the gratuitousness of God’s love and forgiveness. This is in no way to detract from the importance of formulae, laws and divine commandments, but rather to exalt the greatness of the true God, who does not treat us according to our merits or even according to our works but solely according to the boundless generosity of his Mercy (cf. Rom 3:21-30; Ps 129; Lk 11:37-54).

TLM
TLM
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 12:38pm

Rosie, you are not the only one filled with dread as this guy walked out on the balcony. I kept saying to myself: ‘Do something with Papal appropriateness’…….never really happened. Just his look said something to me of ‘Somehow, this isn’t right’. I’ve seen where a lot of people felt that way. Looking back, I’m wondering if the Holy Spirit was saying: ‘Gird you loins and get ready for battle’. It was a surreal experience. One minute you are over the top excited and joyful to see the white smoke and the next…… a sense of dread sets in. I’ve never experienced anything quite like it.

Phillip
Phillip
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 1:24pm

Ditto TLM. I hoped at the time that the feeling was wrong. I am morally certain now that it was not.

Same feeling I get with Cupich and Maradiaga.

Ezabelle
Ezabelle
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 8:24pm

Out of the horses mouth.

http://www.catholicworldreport.com/Blog/4295/cardinal_pell_catholic_means_universal_not_continental.aspx#.ViZElUN1rto.facebook

And to re-iterate Karl’s sentiments about individual Parishes giving Communion to the divorced- Pell has repeated this a reality that has always existed within the Catholic Church:

“some members of that conference have stated they would pursue their own pastoral approaches regarding marriage and the family regardless of what the Synod decides.”

Pell is an honest man and he is not at odds with the Pope, contrary to the drama being reported.

It’s better to go with the facts rather than the opinions and emotions. Some Conservative Catholics don’t like Pope Francis. And Pope Francis doesn’t like some Conservative Catholics. So it’s even. And fair.

But once again, Catholic Doctrine has not changed, nor will it ever under this Pope or any other.

Rosey
Rosey
Sunday, October 25, AD 2015 10:03pm

TLM and Phillip,

Thank you. I received some harsh criticism on that day when I mentioned it to others, so I’ve tried to keep quiet about it since then.

Not that one is happy to be affirmed over such a matter, but it was a real, and powerful feeling, and it’s good to know I’m not the only one.

And yes, quite possibly “gird your loins” was the message.

TLM
TLM
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 4:33am

Philip……..we are in Chicago, so the first time we laid eyes on Cupich, my H said…..’Oh my gosh, Cardinal Bernardin reincarnated? He of course doesn’t look like Bernardin but has the same mannerisms and way of speaking etc. He said ‘This is pretty spooky’. And as you know, Bernardin was bad news.

TLM
TLM
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 4:45am

Ezabelle……yes indeed this has been going on since Vat ll. And just as in Vat ll, I predicted that this will escalate kind of ‘under the radar’, with Priests and Bishops doing their own thing. The non Catholic prelates that are pretending to be Catholic knew this and just wanted to ‘formalize’ the practice out in the open more or less. As Bishop Athanasius Schneider said, we need to go back and look at Vat ll with the eyes of ‘tradition’ and correct what needs correcting. But………..I’m certainly not holding my breath on that one.

Ezabelle
Ezabelle
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 8:36am

TLM, the issue runs deeper than just Communion for the divorced. If you read what Pell wrote, the intent was to always adhere to Doctrine. The Pope ALWAYS intended to adhere to doctrine.

The dialogue about the “family” means how does the Chirch deal with “families” of those who have unions not recognised by the Church ie. how does the Church help these Children whose parents want them to learn the Catholic Faith.

We are lumping all divorced people in the same boat, especially those who desire to be part of the Church but who will not partake in receiving the Eucharist, but still consider themselves Catholic and want to raise their children as Catholic, these families still have a place within the Church – growing and receiving the sacraments.

You can’t make these families in already awful situations who can’t be in full communion with the Church but still want to fit in somehow and make their children fit in, feel complete rejection.

I feel like this is becoming a debate full of scare mongering about the direction of the Church, and making the Synod a one-dimensional monster, rather than recognising situations that the Church should be dealing with, and have not addressed in the past.

Many Catholics have made terrible life mistakes that have alienated them from the Church, but it is nobodies right to deny them a seat at the table if they truly want to do the right thing morally by their children.

God help me here if I suggest that is why the Pope, who many here clearly despise (and that’s on them), is angered by the “conservatives” who threaten their ideal of what a Church should look like, shunning those who don’t fit the “catholic” mould.

Ernst Schreiber
Ernst Schreiber
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 9:06am

It seems to me the ones doing the rejecting are the ones who are in effect saying, “if I am (they are) not allowed to partipate fully in the Church’s sacraments, then the Church is rejecting me (them) because I (they) don’t feel welcome.

Ernst Schreiber
Ernst Schreiber
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 9:16am

It’s a bit of a false dichotomy based upon the strawman figure of the rigorist (priest? layman?) barring the door to the “alienated from the Church” as you called them. I don’t know anywhere where that happens.
.
Heck, Nancy Pelosi can’t even get herself tossed out, despite her best efforts.

Ezabelle
Ezabelle
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 10:12am

Stop using random opportunistic politicians as an example for your argument Ernst.

Divorced remarried Catholics won’t bring their children to the Church to be catechised if they are told there is no place for them at Church. And the vicious cycle continues. You might want to speak to Faithful CONSERVATIVE Catholics who were a product of their parents immoral choices who would not have been catechised if it wasn’t for their parents wanting them to be raised Catholics, and their Parish accepting them.

Not everyone is abusing Church rules. Most Priests are faithful, and are clear about Communion in those circumstances. Don’t paint an entire Church with the tainted brush of a few.

Art Deco
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 10:38am

Divorced remarried Catholics won’t bring their children to the Church to be catechised if they are told there is no place for them at Church.

And who told them there was ‘no place for them’? They’ve been told they cannot take communion because their marriages are irregular. Their marriages are irregular. That they are emotionally upset to be told that or that their children are told that does not render their marriages regular.

.Anzlyne
.Anzlyne
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 10:48am

well Rosey Phillip TLM etal. – I just stood and stared at the TV and didn’t know for sure why I felt vaguely uneasy … Still don’t know what is going on, and still feel trepidation.
Perhaps B16’s resignation advanced the timing a bit but it does seem the pope is filling a role that has been prophesied. As some people say, he is the right pope for our times because God writes straight with crooked lines
It is plain though that problems in the Church are deeper and wider than the pope or the bishops.
.
I know Christ is the Victor, I know that according to Scripture ear tickling and confusion is to be expected. . Fatima warnings must be heeded. We must keep our heads on straight.
.
The talk of “new” church is horrifying. That attacks the One-ness of the Church in Time doesn’t it?
One cardinal spoke of “new” evangelization as “wiping the slate clean and starting over”. Oh my.

T. Shaw
T. Shaw
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 11:20am

“Divorced remarried Catholics won’t bring their children to the Church to be catechised if they are told there is no place for them at Church”
.
A million protestant sects are willing to bear the yoke. And, a sect is only a sect, but the Catholic Church is The Church.
.
Methinks that is the unrepentant parents’ and their unredeemed children’s problem, not The Church’s. Those people made their choices. They can live with it in the here-and-now (which they chose over eternal life), or repent and live. Why should The Church change discipline (not doctrine, cute, huh!) for unrepentant whiners?

Ernst Schreiber
Ernst Schreiber
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 12:02pm

Pelosi wasn’t chosen at random. She was chosen as a counter-example because I wouldn’t put it past her to be trying to get herself formally excommunicated for opportunistic political reasons. The point is she can’t. The larger point is the Church shouldn’t be held responsible for the misapprehensions of others.

who told them there was ‘no place for them’?

I also would like to know who these people are and when they meet. I have some thoughts about red-headed step-children that I’d like to bring before the unwelcoming committee!

TLM
TLM
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 3:47pm

Ezabelle, this idea that the Church has not accepted divorced and remarried Catholics into the Church to raise their children and to take part in the life of the Church is total nonsense. Since when and in what neck of the woods? These feel good ideas and castigation of Church policy of neglecting out of Church marriages that the Bishops were throwing around at the Synod don’t exist. We have been welcoming irregular couples into the Church forever. They just cannot receive Communion. We have all kinds of irregular people in my Parish for instance and they are as welcomed and loved as anyone else is. The notion that they are not is poppycock.

And as far as people ‘despising’ the Pope??? There is a difference between calling out what the Pope does or says as not in line with Church teaching and ‘despising’ him. They are two different things. Have you been watching this Pope for the last 2 1/2 years? He doesn’t prescribe to traditional teachings of the Church. I would be very doubtful if anyone on this forum ‘despises’ the Pope. Myself, I pray for him daily, and LOVE him in the way God demands that I do, but I’m not required to LIKE what he does, even according to Church teaching……….AND I DON’T. I would suggest you do a little more reading up and you just may understand where people are coming from.

Ezabelle
Ezabelle
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 4:21pm

“Methinks that is the unrepentant parents’ and their unredeemed children’s problem, not The Church’s. Those people made their choices. They can live with it in the here-and-now (which they chose over eternal life), or repent and live. Why should The Church change discipline (not doctrine, cute, huh!) for unrepentant whiners?”

Who are you to say who has repent enter like you’re watching everyone’s business. Do you monitor who walks up to receive Communion? And whine about it. They just bin their faith altogether and don’t come. The Church needs to bring people back to the Church. It is their responsibility. These children never hear the Truth if their parents don’t bring them. If they can’t receive Communion, and rightly so, what is their place? Can they join ministry’s within the Church, can they lead Scripture groups. Can they walk in without having judging eyes hurt their feelings- Yes because humans have emotions. Surprise! Can they feel a sense of normal at all because they don’t fit in. Does it hurt? Will they tire and give up?

“That they are emotionally upset to be told that or that their children are told that does not render their marriages regular.” That’s nasty. What a cruel thing to say. (Water off your back probably).

I know some commenters who live this situation have testified they don’t receive Communion and are ok and are at a place in their faith where they are living ok. But not all will feel the same way, and will they no longer have a place within the Church. Not receiving the Body and Blood of Christ is an awful situation to be in when you cannot discard an immoral relationship that has produced children. They live with that. Why rub salt in the wound?

It is the Church’s responsibility especially for the children.

“also would like to know who these people are and when they meet”
Some of them meet here.

Ezabelle
Ezabelle
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 4:25pm

Good for you TLM. Keep praying for him. Some of the things that have directed towards the Pope, as a human being, I wouldn’t say about an animal. It’s quite disgusting really.

Ernst Schreiber
Ernst Schreiber
Monday, October 26, AD 2015 8:24pm

Who are you to say who has repent enter like you’re watching everyone’s business. Do you monitor who walks up to receive Communion?

Nobody does this. People claiming that this happens are, for the most part, doing so because they have an agenda.

The Church needs to bring people back to the Church. It is their responsibility. These children never hear the Truth if their parents don’t bring them. If they can’t receive Communion, and rightly so, what is their place? Can they join ministry’s within the Church, can they lead Scripture groups. Can they walk in without having judging eyes hurt their feelings- Yes because humans have emotions. Surprise! Can they feel a sense of normal at all because they don’t fit in. Does it hurt? Will they tire and give up?

The Eucharist may be the source and summit of Christian life, but it’s not the totality of it. Now maybe somewhere perhaps there is a parish where you’re not allowed into the multi-purpose room for coffee and donuts because you skipped communion, but I doubt it. Personally, I don’t see a problem with leading Scripture groups, but should there be one, participation isn’t synonymous with leadership. Anyways, we don’t always get to do what it is we want to do at the time we want to do it and in the way we want to do it. Just ask Mandy P.

If they can’t receive Communion, and rightly so, what is their place? [….] I know some commenters who live this situation have testified they don’t receive Communion and are ok and are at a place in their faith where they are living ok. But not all will feel the same way, and will they no longer have a place within the Church. Not receiving the Body and Blood of Christ is an awful situation to be in when you cannot discard an immoral relationship that has produced children. They live with that. Why rub salt in the wound?

Eucharist as either participation trophy or salt in the wound? I don’t think that’s what was meant by active participation in the Mass. In any event, if we’re going to compel people to come in, we owe it to them to make sure they have their wedding garment on.

Finally, it occurs to me that we need a version of Godwin’s law that covers “Do it for the Children!” Probably that’s just my native conservatism showing. Statists are always arguing that we need to do something for their sakes. (Except when it comes to saddling them with our debt. Then it’s scew the little buggers. –Apologies for going wingnutter.)

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